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One of the things that I have been focused on is like oh my gosh, I'm going to be 70 soon.
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Do I have enough time left to get all the things done that I want to do?
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What's your advice about that?
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What kinds of discussions that you have with people around the whole issue of time?
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Yeah, well, I had one person that had a great saying that, instead of having a bucket list, they had an anti-bucket list, which were the things that they no longer felt they had to do or needed to do.
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So you know, I think when we're younger, we have a little bit of FOMO, fear of missing out, and we want to do everything, and I think this particular person that I interviewed talked about I don't need to do those things anymore.
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I don't need to prove myself to anyone anymore.
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I can say no to things that I don't want to do, and be very judicious with their time in terms of what they do spend it on, and we do have less time in front of us than behind us, and so how do we learn how to really manage that, I think, in the best way, so that we do the things we love instead of doing the things that we feel like we have to do.
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Hi, I'm Linus Woods Mullins and I love to help women to vibe, to be more vibrant, intuitive, beautiful and empowered in midlife.
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So come on, let's vibe.
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You know, as I get closer and closer to 70, which is like two years from where I am now so I don't know when you're going to be listening to this, but if you're listening to this in 2025, I'm just a couple months away from 68.
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So I'm preparing myself for 70, if I should be so blessed to live to 70.
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And when you have lived that long, you begin to start putting some things into perspective and taking a look at the conglomeration of experiences that you've had and how it's impacted you, and maybe what things you can do with the time that you have left.
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Whether it's another 20 years, 30 years, whatever, I don't think I have another 70 years.
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I always talk about midlife.
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I think I'm way past midlife, but anyway, the whole idea of how well did you live your life, what kinds of things that you do, that you're proud of, that you want to share with others.
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Well, I'm so happy today to have with us Skye Bergman, who is an award-winning filmmaker, photographer and author, also a professor.
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She's done a documentary that's on PBS called Lives Well-Lived, and also she wrote a book called Lives Well-Lived Generations, and what she's talking about is celebrating the wisdom and resilience of older adults and highlighting the importance of intergenerational connections.
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Skye, it's so wonderful to have you here on the Vibe Living podcast today.
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I'm just delighted to be here.
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Thank you for having me.
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Absolutely so glad that we connected.
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Now Skye and I connected in a different way.
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I happen to be signed to a gray hair modeling agency and she participates or is involved with them as well.
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We both have gray hair, as you can see For those of you who are looking at the YouTube version and not taking a look at the audio version, so that's how we met and through the few months or so, I began a little bit to get a little bit more familiar with her work and the fact that she wrote this wonderful book, and I am so glad that she is gracing us with her presence.
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Scott, you've got to tell me what inspired you to write this book Lives, Well-Lived Generations, and how has the process of making the film and writing the book shaped your understanding of aging and intergenerational connections?
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Yeah, that's a really good question and a big question, so I will kind of break it down from the beginning, which was when I started working on the film.
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I was looking at approaching 50, which I think that half century mark, especially for women, is a really big marker in time, and I'm 59.
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So, just to you know, that was back when I was about 45.
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And I was just not seeing anything positive out there about aging.
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Everything that I saw were all the anti-aging creams you could use to look more in quotes youthful those things that were in TV and on movies were all the negative aspects of aging.
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That's changed in the 15 years since, but at that time that was certainly not the case.
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And in my own family I had this amazing role model of my grandmother who was turning 100, who was still working out at the gym.
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She didn't start working out until she was 80.
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So she proved to me that it's never too late to start something new, even working out at the gym, and I thought I need to find more people like my grandmother who are living full and meaningful lives.
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That can be my role model.
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Since I'm not seeing it out there, I need to create that pool of people that I can pull from for my own way of looking at life, and so I ended up spending four years interviewing 40 people that were 75 and above, with a collective life experience of 3,000 years, and put together a film.
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I didn't know I was doing a film when I started this project.
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It was such a personal project and, as I tell my students, the more personal, the more universal the message becomes, and it certainly struck a chord and really the book came about because I had so many people asking me well, what are the things that you learn from all the 3000 years of collective life experience?
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Can you distill it down and put it into a book so that we can read about it?
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And I know that people were taking furious notes when they were watching the film, about their favorite quotes and whatever.
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So I decided okay, I'm going to sit down and write a book.
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I'm dyslexic, so it's not easy for me to write, but I just felt so compelled by all the people that had reached out to me, and so I put together a book and really talked about my process of being a first-time filmmaker and ending up on PBS and what that was like and the lessons that I learned along the way and really I think there were four key elements that I learned from all the.
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The first was having a sense of purpose, and I think for many of us that changes over our lifetime, and especially in that moment when maybe we retire from our day job.
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You know, a lot of times when people ask you what do you do, the first thing you say is your job and your profession, and when you don't have that anymore you're kind of shifting.
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What a sense of purpose.
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Whether it was getting up every morning to teach English as a second language, volunteering to do that, making mozzarella's for his daughter's deli that was Lucky Louie's thing that he was a pediatrician, but then when he retired he started making mozzarella every morning.
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Whatever it is, there's got to be some reason that you want to get up every day and give back in some way.
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And I think the second thing was really about community.
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Having a sense of community.
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It doesn't matter if it's family or friends, but feeling like you are part of something bigger than yourself and that you have people you can count on.
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And the third and fourth thing really go hand in hand, which is a sense of resilience and positivity.
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And those are really the things that I learned from doing the film and from writing the book and kind of distilling it down.
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It was quite a process.
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I love the key points that you learned and one of the things that I wanted to zero in on because I think it's really important and that is the purpose.
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You know, I work with women and have been working with women for 18 years over the age of 40.
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Their average age is between 45 and 55.
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And this is an ongoing, reoccurring theme discovering they're not quite sure what their purpose is, and perhaps part of the reason is that we play so many roles in our lives and the roles that we play are not necessarily self-serving.
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Most of it is outer directed.
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So by the time we get to the point of, okay, what's my purpose?
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For me, A lot of women have a tendency to draw a blank.
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So what did you learn as you were interviewing people about how people came to find what their purpose was if they thought perhaps they didn't have one?
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That is a really good question and I absolutely think you're right.
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Especially women, we tend to give so much of ourselves to other people that we forget about satisfying our own needs.
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Sometimes it's like that oxygen mask story, you know put the oxygen mask on yourself first so you can take care of the person next to you, your child, whoever needs help.
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And I think we tend to do it in reverse many times in our lives.
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And I think as we get older, maybe that's a time that we have that we can explore that a little bit more of how do we take care of ourselves.
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And I think the other thing is changing the narrative.
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So it's not selfish to be taking care of ourselves first.
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Actually, it's very selfless to be doing that, because it allows you to do more and to take care of other people.
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And when we are run down and we are doing everything else for everyone else, we don't have that energy to be really present.
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So I think the people that I interviewed how did they find their passion?
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Or their sense of purpose?
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Is really finding their passion?
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I guess that's really what it's about is finding.
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What do they love doing, what makes them happy, what warms their heart when they're in the middle of doing it.
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For many people, it is really about giving back in some way.
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So, even though they're taking care of themselves or doing something that gives back in some way that brings them some joy, but it's doing something very purposefully and very authentically in terms of the things that they love doing.
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So, you know, it doesn't really matter what it is, just finding that thing that brings, that sparks joy, that brings you joy in your life, and doing more of that and finding ways to, I think, keep that consistent.
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Not just doing one class and something and then deciding, no, I'm done, you know, but really finding what is that thing that just you can't wait to get up to do every day.
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And it's different for every people, so there's not really like a defined way that I can say this is what everybody should do, because I think there's a lot of self-discovery that needs to happen and I think allowing yourself that time to find that self-discovery, to figure out what the things are that you like and don't like, I mean that's part of it.
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Sometimes we are living our lives so quickly and so fully that we don't even have time to discover that, and a lot of times, yeah, there's something else that just jumped out at me, and that's time.
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Yeah, one of the things that I have been focused on is like oh my gosh, I'm going to be 70 soon, you know, in a couple of weeks.
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Do I have enough time left to get all the things done that I want to do?
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What's your advice about that?
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What kinds of discussions did you have with people around the whole issue of time?
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Yeah Well, I had one person that had a great saying that, instead of having a bucket list, they had an anti-bucket list, which were the things that they no longer felt they had to do or needed to do.
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So you know, I think when we're younger, we have a little bit of FOMO, fear of missing out, and we want to do everything, and I think this particular person that I interviewed talked about I don't need to do those things anymore.
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I don't need to prove myself to anyone anymore.
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I can say no to things that I don't want to do, and be very judicious with their time in terms of what they do spend it on, and we do have less time in front of us than behind us, and so how do we learn how to really manage that, I think, in the best way, so that we do the things we love instead of doing the things that we feel like we have to do, and that's that's a.
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It's hard to learn how to say no, but it's a very powerful word to say no to things that we know just don't feel right or they're just going to be a time suck for us.
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Yeah, they always say all the time that no is a complete sentence.
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No is something that we as women generally struggle with, because part of our process is trying to figure out a way to do it, because, once again, leading with service and not necessarily leading with what might serve us better.
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But as you get older you have an opportunity to kind of flip the script on that.
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Absolutely you do.
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I think that age gives us that opportunity to say no to things to, and to say yes to things that might sound a little iffy and a little crazy, and doing something out of our comfort zone just to experience something different.
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I think that you should not let age be a determining factor of what you can and cannot do.
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Like I said with my grandmother, who started working out at the gym at 80.
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And she loved it.
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That was her social community.
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She felt better.
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She had a phrase which I'm sure other people have move it or lose it.
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And but you know, in her 60s she wasn't ready to do that and in her 80s it was the right moment for her.
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So I think about the great Ernst Shepard, who started working out at the age of 50 something and she had a trigger.
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She had lost two loved ones to diabetes and she decided that that was not going to be the way that she went up.
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And so she started working out and found out she had an affinity for it and ended up being like the number one bodybuilder woman in her age category, and she's well into her 80s now and still working out, still doing things those kinds of stories about you know, your mother, your grandmother and Ernestine Shepard are very encouraging.
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But tell me, what were some of the aha moments that you had or that you witnessed through writing the book, when you were talking with the younger generation and the older generation?
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What were some of the really meaningful connections that you made?
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Well, I think the aha moments were really reflecting back on all the years that I've been working on the film and this intergenerational project and realizing that, you know, right now we have such divides in our country and we think about, you know, divides around religion, around race, but there's also divides around age, and ageism is definitely a big ism that we don't talk about that much.
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And I think that was a big aha moment because I've been doing projects where we connect older adults and students and, of course, the thing that they learn at the end of their time together is that I think, on that one-on-one level, I think that's what's missing.
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We tend to stay very segregated in our own little groups and to break those barriers down.
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I think then, instead of it being us versus them, it's the we, and that was a real aha moment for me.
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That is an aha moment.
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Absolutely, and you're absolutely right One of the things that's going on in this country right now, no matter what side of the fence you sit on.
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I think we can all attest to the fact that it's pretty stressful.
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It's definitely causing a lot of anxiety because of all the uncertainty in the future, and it's an interesting time to be in at the age that we are in.
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So, taking a look at the frame of reference of writing the book, what kind of advice do you think you could give those women who are out here feeling a certain kind of way and wondering, you know, how should they be encoding the world now as they're moving forward?
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Yeah, that's another really good question.
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I think that you know, one of the things that we can all do is to get out of our isolated little bubble and to get out of our comfort zone and meet people of different ages, different races, different religions.
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And a number of ways that you can do that Join, you know, different organizations, volunteer, be part of a group that you feel passionate about and learn from people of all different ages.
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One of the things that I did when I was in my mid-40s like looking at that 50 and thinking, oh my god, I don't have enough women, friends and what can I do to bring more joy and more women into my life of all different ages was I started doing a ladies potluck dinner that I do the first monday of every month.
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I have people from the ages of 20 to 90 that come and what that does for me is I reconnect.
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I formed my own tribe and I'm informed by those people of all different ages, all different races, all different religions that come together once a month.
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So you know, do what you can to form that.
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I guess you have to be a little bit proactive about that.
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I think you can't just sit at home and be isolated.
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You really do have to kind of put yourself out there a little bit to make that happen.
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You know, I think that's a wonderful point because as we get older, I've noticed that women in particular have a tendency to self-select out.
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They don't want to be a bother or a burden to anyone.
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They're thinking that everybody's so busy that no one has time to connect, and everybody's thinking that and nobody's connecting.
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And the reality is I can tell you from working with a lot of women a lot of women are sitting at home.
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You know, getting a PhD in Netflix or Hulu.
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It's a great idea to reach out to that friend that you haven't seen for a while.
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I know I've been guilty for different reasons.
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I am so involved in my business and my business is all online and I'm talking to people all the time.
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It feels like I'm actually connecting with folks.
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But I have to be reminded when I was traveling I just got through traveling for the last six, seven weeks that I still needed to make sure that I have that human connection, and what a difference it is.
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I would be at airports and this was really weird, but it's true.
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True, I would be in the airport and this happened to me about three or four times while I was traveling.
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Somebody walked with me.
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I know you from somewhere, and so I am trying to search my mind and think, okay, where can I have seen that?
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Whatever it is, I'm searching my mind and thinking, oh my gosh, last time I was with people that I didn't know was two years ago or whatever, and they'll finally realize where they see me is on my social media because it seems so real.
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But it's not the same as actually having an interaction with someone.
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And they do say it's not just a, it's not just a myth.
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It's true that when women gather and meet and spend time together, there is a hormone that is secreted more than at any other time, and that's when women spend time together.
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So, if you want to look at it this way, it's life affirming.
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It's good for you to have that urge to self-select out and to get out there.
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And when you think about the book that you've written and all the experiences you've had as a result of writing the book, what is it that you're hoping that the viewers of the movie and the readers of the book take away with them?
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What is it that you hope that they're learning?
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Well, I think that if for the book and the movie, I think it's, you know, the four lessons that I talked about, and really you see that very much in the film, because a lot of the people that were in the film went through World War Two and they went through times of hardship and how did they face that?
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With resilience and positivity and hearing about their sense of purpose and how they reframed their life throughout their age.
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I think all of that is it's a you know, when you see it and you hear the firsthand account, it really hits home.
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And so that's one thing that I think works really well about the film and it's resonated with audiences because it's just got renewed on PBS for another four years and I mean it's just had a life of its own, which is amazing.
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And yeah, and then I think the book, you know, distill some of that down.
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Sometimes it's people learn in different ways and so some for some people, reading might be a different way than watching a film to learn about that, and it distills down the essence of the film and then my favorite quotes from each of the people that I interviewed in the film, and the second half of the book is really dedicated to connecting generations.
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So I interviewed 40 people around the globe that are doing really interesting work connecting generations, whether it's through something called Generations Over Dinner, or Cycling Without Age, which started in Denmark, where they take a tricycle out and they have a younger person biking and two older people in the front and they have these wonderful conversations And's worldwide now, or an intergenerational symphony or co-generational housing just different ways that we can bring generations together.
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But I also wanted to go back to the women gathering because I just in this past week, amazingly saw a next door neighbor.
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Somebody put out just a call hey, ladies, I'm going to do this thing.
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And if you sort of similar to me, but they just put it out on next door neighbor, like to whoever wants to show up, I'm going to do a craft day and potluck, please come.
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And then on another Facebook group, somebody put her name out and said hey, I'm in the mid forties and I'm looking for women, friends, and these are the things that I like to do and anyone that wants to join me, please, like, let's go for a hike.
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And I thought how great is that, you know, putting yourself out there in that way so you know you're not isolated and you're not alone and you create a space for people, for women, to gather, for amazing things to happen.
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So it doesn't have to be something monumental like can be something very small on a very local level that makes that happen.
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You know it's interesting about.
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I've done this event three times where me and another lady from Southern California I'm in the Northern California area we came together and brought women together who are our age and was outside in my backyard and the tennis court.
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We had umbrellas and it was really nice.
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But one of the things that everybody loved about it was just the opportunity to get together and it was amazing how many degrees of separation.
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It was like two degrees and I didn't even know her.
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It was just amazing.
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It was just getting together and talking and pouring into each other.
00:20:45.020 --> 00:20:47.490
But people are still asking me when are you going to do another one?
00:20:47.490 --> 00:20:57.195
And I said, okay, I'm definitely going to do another one because I use it and I just think it's an opportunity for women to come together and celebrate each other.
00:20:57.195 --> 00:21:02.599
And I know your book isn't this focused on women, but since I talk about women, I'm, you know, kind of focusing on that.
00:21:02.599 --> 00:21:12.782
But for all of you who are listening, please go ahead and check out this wonderful series on PBS Lives Well, lived and also Skye's book.
00:21:12.782 --> 00:21:19.044
I have all the URLs that you need about Skye in the show page, a direct link to her book as well.
00:21:19.044 --> 00:21:22.311
And when does the Lives Well Lived air on PBS?
00:21:22.311 --> 00:21:23.828
Is it different times, different markets?
00:21:23.950 --> 00:21:28.166
It's different times and different markets, but it's also on Amazon and iTunes and Canopy.
00:21:28.166 --> 00:21:34.530
So if you have a library card, pretty much you can see Lives Well Lived, and if you have a PBS membership, you can see it for free on PBS Passport.
00:21:34.530 --> 00:21:36.548
Yes, PBS membership everybody.
00:21:37.540 --> 00:21:48.590
That's going to be more important more than ever to be able to get alternative points of view and to get some really good information about culture, which is something that I feel like we're beginning to let go of.
00:21:48.590 --> 00:21:53.776
That we need to grab back, because it kind of defines who we are as individuals and as a people.
00:21:53.776 --> 00:21:57.548
But, Skye, thank you so much for being on the Vibe Living podcast.
00:21:57.548 --> 00:21:59.101
It's been wonderful having you here today.
00:21:59.382 --> 00:22:00.044
Yeah, thank you.
00:22:00.044 --> 00:22:01.067
Thank you so much for having me.
00:22:01.067 --> 00:22:01.888
This has been a blast.
00:22:02.109 --> 00:22:04.705
Yeah, it's been great and thank you to all of you who've been listening.
00:22:04.705 --> 00:22:06.270
I've been seeing your comments.
00:22:06.270 --> 00:22:17.108
Please continue to comment, like and share and subscribe to this podcast, because that's what keeps us going.
00:22:17.108 --> 00:22:19.155
The podcast is doing well and is growing, and I would like to get to the top 5%.
00:22:19.155 --> 00:22:21.964
We're at the top 8% right now of podcasts globally, so let's get to the top 5.
00:22:21.964 --> 00:22:27.525
Share this podcast out and take a look at all the hundreds of podcasts that we have for the Vibe Living Podcast.
00:22:27.525 --> 00:22:39.570
I truly do believe that, for women in particular, it's all about the vibe being more vibrant, more intuitive, more beautiful and empowered to live an active and great midlife and beyond.
00:22:39.570 --> 00:23:05.942
Have a fantastic day, everybody, and don't forget the vibe living podcast and don't forget to subscribe, like and comment and share this podcast.
00:23:05.942 --> 00:23:08.945
Have a fantastic day and don't forget the vibe.
00:23:08.945 --> 00:23:09.887
Bye, bye, everybody.
